Hello Ogg;

Ogg wrote to Mindsurfer <=-

https://www.the-sun.com/lifestyle/3284914/what-is-the-freedom-
phone/

A publication that believes in data mining writes about it? Really?

..so maybe it's not entirely what I thought it COULD be.

On most common droids and iPhones, every keystroke is tracable. This was
told to me by a friend who's a forensics expert for our state police force. They can figure out who you text, what you say, etc. This freedom phone/OS
is supposed to strip that "feature" away. Beware of any publication that does NOT mention this.

... Old beekeepers never die, they just buzz off.
--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
* Origin: Carnage - risen from the dead now on SBBS (21:4/107)

Ogg wrote to Mindsurfer <=-

https://www.the-sun.com/lifestyle/3284914/what-is-the-freedom-
phone/

..it writes:

.."people took to Twitter to discuss the Freedom Phone's free
speech promise. [...] Another replied: "So you're telling me
a `Freedom Phone' is basically a generic Android Device, with
Parler, Telegram, Rumble, OAN, Newsroom, Duck Duck Go and a
VPN preloaded? Wow. A new sucker is born every day."

Bypassing the Google surveillance ecosystem is a huge leap in privacy.

Between the choice of apps (really? You're going to put Parler on a phone
that respects your privacy?) and the wavy American flag on the web site, they're aiming towards the "patriots" who feel that the left-wing tech companies and social networks are trying to "cancel" them.

Give me a phone running AOSP or something close to it, don't load google services, include Tor and a VPN service, Signal as a SMS client, an alternative app store and a privacy-aware browser, any day.




... The city devours the land, the people devour the city...
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

i just thought about if big tech can do anything about it. what if big apps are recognizing when you use the freedom phone and stop working?
like with rooted phones and payment apps?

I assume it's the sort of thing where an arms race happens if the pro-privacy things get a big enough portion of the market.

E.g., ad blockers were basically ignored until they became fairly common, at which point it became an arms race.

Incidentally, this is why I kind of hope that 68k.news remains pretty small. It's a delight to use, is great for use in logging into hotel networks
(or other networks that hijack web pages for login), doesn't have clickbait or unexpected videos, and boy howdy would it be ended by _someone_ if it got remotely big.

So, umm, don't tell your friends?

Maybe the same with the Freedom Phone, though I'm guessing that one probably needs a decently-large userbase to _survive_.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Storm BBS (21:2/108)

speech promise. [...] Another replied: "So you're telling me
a `Freedom Phone' is basically a generic Android Device, with

Oh. Well, that's disappointing.

I always hope for a phone that comes with as little as possible pre-installed.

Heck, I'm still not sure about phones having _phone_ functionality. Talk
about a feature I never use...

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Storm BBS (21:2/108)

Heck, I'm still not sure about phones having _phone_ functionality. Talk about a feature I never use...

Right! The only thing I use my phone for these days, is chatting on Matrix, reading some news and running a BBS from lol. I don't remember the last time I actually made a phone call with it haha.

---
|14Best regards,
|11Ch|03rist|11ia|15n |11a|03ka |11Me|03aTLoT|11io|15N

|07�� |08[|10eml|08] |15ml@erb.pw |07�� |08[|10web|08] |15www.erb.pw |07��Ŀ |07�� |08[|09fsx|08] |1521:1/158 |07�� |08[|11tqw|08] |151337:1/101 |07���� |07�� |08[|12rtn|08] |1580:774/81 |07�� |08[|14fdn|08] |152:250/5 |07����
|07�� |08[|10ark|08] |1510:104/2 |07��

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2020/12/04 (Linux/64)
* Origin: thE qUAntUm wOrmhOlE, rAmsgAtE, uK. bbs.erb.pw (21:1/158)

Re: RE: freedom phone
By: Mindsurfer to Ogg on Thu Jul 15 2021 10:27 am

https://freedomphone.com/

sounds promising.

i just thought about if big tech can do anything about it. what if big
apps are recognizing when you use the freedom phone and stop working?
like with rooted phones and payment apps?

but in general i like the idea of the freedom phone. you heard for how
much they are selling it? will the app store also work on other phones? could you think of any cons or are there just pros?

Regards,
Stephan /Mindsurfer

I personally think trying with cleansed Androids is a dead end for software freedom. There are cool cleansed Androids like Replicant and Lineageos already but they only get you so far. They aren't better Androids than Android and they can't expect to be.

The main problem with cleansed Androids is that people will try them out expecting to be able to do with them the same things they do on regular Android, and will become disappointed when they don't. The /E/ project seems mindful of this and therefore they are building a complete ecosystem for their phones (with their own filesharing, messaging etc) but I bet they will fail at runing many Android programs.

IMO we should be trying to build our own thing with its own ecosystem and strong points of its own. If it ever becomes popular enough then banks and playment gateways will develop their junk for it. An Android clone does not have strong points of its own - Android basically sucks, and an Android with less features is hard to market even if it comes with the BIG advantage of not selling your info to Googlñe E-Warlords.

--
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Re: Re: freedom phone
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Ogg on Thu Jul 15 2021 06:53 am

Ogg wrote to Mindsurfer <=-

https://www.the-sun.com/lifestyle/3284914/what-is-the-freedom-
phone/

..it writes:

.."people took to Twitter to discuss the Freedom Phone's free
speech promise. [...] Another replied: "So you're telling me
a `Freedom Phone' is basically a generic Android Device, with
Parler, Telegram, Rumble, OAN, Newsroom, Duck Duck Go and a
VPN preloaded? Wow. A new sucker is born every day."

Bypassing the Google surveillance ecosystem is a huge leap in privacy.

Between the choice of apps (really? You're going to put Parler on a phone that respects your privacy?) and the wavy American flag on the web site, they're aiming towards the "patriots" who feel that the left-wing tech companies and social networks are trying to "cancel" them.

Give me a phone running AOSP or something close to it, don't load google services, include Tor and a VPN service, Signal as a SMS client, an alternative app store and a privacy-aware browser, any day.

... The city devours the land, the people devour the city...

Tor/VPN infrastructure in Android SUCKS hard if you are serious about it.

Some interesting work done in it: https://blog.torproject.org/mission-improbable-hardening-android-security-and-p rivacy

https://blog.torproject.org/mission-impossible-hardening-android-security-and-p rivacy

I recommend the second link to everybody who is interested.

The main problem is that Android likes setting the network up and sending network traffic before Tor or VPNs can be brought up during startup, so the whole setup is leaky unless you exercise extreme care. To the point you are supposed to use a freaking external device as a firewall with your phone to cut leaky traffic down.

Not to mention that many Android programs ignore or have mangled proxy configuration, so you cannot be sure a generic application configured to use a local Tor instance will actually use it. You need to be able to firewall and intercept the traffic of your own device to be sure because the Android implementation of nearly everything is a pile of stinking, uncontrolable Eldritch tentacles extracted straight from Necronomicon.

It is a dead end.

When I was into phone modding I found myself that I spent more time fighting
my own device than using it. Once you think you have set a firewall to block all the traffic that is not pushed through the anonimity network you like you find lots of programs that are not supposed to be generating network traffic are failing to download files because the download manager is trying to bypass your Tor instance and failing.

Mobile platforms can only be fixe one way. We have to take them to the backyard, put them on their knees and shoot them in the head so their terrorist attempts against sane design practices are put to an end. Then we have to start over with something that is at least _sane_.

Then, after 6 months of modding your phone and having it in a state in which it it leaks close to no information, you loose it in the pasture, your favourite horse finds it before you do, and then you have not a phone anymore.


And THIS is the reason why my daily phone is a Nokia 150 today.

--
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On 19 Jul 2021, Jimmy Anderson said the following...

Adept wrote to Mindsurfer <=-

Incidentally, this is why I kind of hope that 68k.news remains pretty small. It's a delight to use, is great for use in logging into hotel networks (or other networks that hijack web pages for login), doesn't have clickbait or unexpected videos, and boy howdy would it be ended _someone_ if it got remotely big.

So, umm, don't tell your friends?

LOL - hadn't heard of this, but will check it out...

I'm pretty sure Action Retro said on one of his videos that he open sourced the code, so worst case you ought to be able to roll your own and just not advertise it.

GreenLFC � e> greenleaderfanclub@protonmail.com
Infosec / Ham / Retro � masto> greenleaderfanclub@distrotoot
Avoids Politics on BBS � gem> gemini.greenleader.xyz

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/06/21 (Raspberry Pi/32)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbs>>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

On 17 Jul 2021, Utopian Galt said the following...

I think people want to know whats the processor of the phone, how much memory is in the phone
before they want to buy this. I loathe Google, and Apple is slightly better, but still evil.

Also independent operating systems do need a neutral pay system like Samsung/Apple/Google Pay.

I would be interested in seeing the specs myself. Looks pretty sketchy actually. From the demos I've seen it looks like a rebranded Umidigi A9, which is a Chinese phone. Oh, and you can get it for about $120 rather than the $500 Freedom Phone is charging for it.

There are a lot of other things that make this seem pretty sketchy and a rip-off but I'm sure that an internet search would show those without me going into it.

Personally I am waiting for the Pixel 6 pro to come out. Easy to root and load whatever I want on it and make my own "freedom phone"

-=>Richard Miles<=-
-=>Captain Obvious<=-
-=>bbs.shadowscope.com<=-

... User Error: Replace user and hit any key to continue...

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/07/16 (Windows/32)
* Origin: * Shadowscope BBS * (21:1/157)

On 18 Jul 2021, Ogg said the following...

The specs don't indicate the cell bands it supports.
Therefore, the Pinephone is really just a scaled-down-to-
phonesize tablet that uses wifi for IP phone services?

Worldwide, Global LTE bands
LTE-FDD: B1/ B2/ B3/ B4/ B5/ B7/ B8/ B12/ B13/ B18/ B19/ B20/ B25/ B26/ B28 LTE-TDD: B38/ B39/ B40/ B41
WCDMA: B1/ B2/ B4/ B5/ B6/ B8/ B19
GSM: 850/900/1800/1900MHz

-=>Richard Miles<=-
-=>Captain Obvious<=-
-=>bbs.shadowscope.com<=-

... Reward for a job well done: More work

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/07/16 (Windows/32)
* Origin: * Shadowscope BBS * (21:1/157)

On 18 Jul 2021, Ogg said the following...

NEVERMIND! I see "Quectel EG-25G with worldwide bands"
Apparently that supports "Worldwide LTE, UMTS/HSPA+ and GSM/

Heh. Right after I posted my last message. That's what I get for being a few days behind.

-=>Richard Miles<=-
-=>Captain Obvious<=-
-=>bbs.shadowscope.com<=-

... A Meteor is an example of a rock star.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/07/16 (Windows/32)
* Origin: * Shadowscope BBS * (21:1/157)

Arelor wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

And THIS is the reason why my daily phone is a Nokia 150 today.

Amen to that.

I'd played with an old Nokia 3110 for a month at a time, unfortunately, the
2G and 3G networks are going away (or are already gone around here) making older phones bricks.

Maybe one of these Linux-based phones will make a better hardened platform than Android.


... Magnify the most difficult details
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

Adept wrote to Ogg <=-

I always hope for a phone that comes with as little as possible pre-installed.

If you want as little crapware, but as clean of an Android experience as possible with only Google apps, Motorola is pretty good. I went from an old Samsung S5 to Motorola and found it refreshingly free of branded apps, third-party apps bundled with the phone, and the lot.


... Only a part, not the whole
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

MeaTLoTioN wrote to Adept <=-

Heck, I'm still not sure about phones having _phone_ functionality. Talk about a feature I never use...

Right! The only thing I use my phone for these days, is chatting on Matrix, reading some news and running a BBS from lol. I don't remember
the last time I actually made a phone call with it haha.

I found myself doomscrolling on Twitter and spending a lot of time on
Reddit, and removed all of the social media apps from my phone. Now, if I've got some time to kill, I'm reading e-books, and I like it.

I got into a couple of email lists a few years ago that listed whatever free books were on Amazon that day, and I'm up to 600 or so books. I've got some reading to do.


... Only one element of each kind
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

Re: Re: freedom phone
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Arelor on Fri Jul 16 2021 07:21 am

Arelor wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

And THIS is the reason why my daily phone is a Nokia 150 today.

Amen to that.

I'd played with an old Nokia 3110 for a month at a time, unfortunately, the 2G and 3G networks are going away (or are already gone around here) making older phones bricks.

Maybe one of these Linux-based phones will make a better hardened platform than Android.

... Magnify the most difficult details

2G network is scheduled to be estinguished after 3G in Spain. 2G is essential for many industrial applications and they don't want to cut it down so happily.

There is a thriving market for cheapo feature phones so I have the hope they will comercialize flip phones adapted to the new networks.

I think Linux/BSD on a portable device such as a table of phone would be awesome, but then I suspect people would not use it as an Android replacement at all. I rather picture technicians doing pen-testing from their tablets or patching software on the fly. Portable gadgets like these are uncomfortable to work on but if they could run the proper software they could be good portable toolboxes for IT people.


--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (21:2/138)

Hello Arelor!

** On Friday 16.07.21 - 04:19, Arelor wrote to poindexter FORTRAN:

[...]

Then, after 6 months of modding your phone and having it in
a state in which it it leaks close to no information, you
loose it in the pasture, your favourite horse finds it
before you do, and then you have not a phone anymore.

LOL.

A solution: do NOT bring meticulously modded phone with you to
pasture. OR.. use a blutooth ear piece in place of handling
phone directly. (?)



--- OpenXP 5.0.50
* Origin: (} Pointy McPointFace (21:4/106.21)

If you want as little crapware, but as clean of an Android experience as possible with only Google apps, Motorola is pretty good. I went from an old Samsung S5 to Motorola and found it refreshingly free of branded
apps, third-party apps bundled with the phone, and the lot.

I think Google apps are most of the crapware I don't want.

In this case, if I'm going for a phone with this in mind, the first and only qualification would be, "How easily can I root it and replace it with one of the alternative Android OSs?".

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Storm BBS (21:2/108)

Re: freedom phone
By: Ogg to Arelor on Fri Jul 16 2021 08:59 pm

Hello Arelor!

** On Friday 16.07.21 - 04:19, Arelor wrote to poindexter FORTRAN:

[...]

Then, after 6 months of modding your phone and having it in
a state in which it it leaks close to no information, you
loose it in the pasture, your favourite horse finds it
before you do, and then you have not a phone anymore.

LOL.

A solution: do NOT bring meticulously modded phone with you to
pasture. OR.. use a blutooth ear piece in place of handling
phone directly. (?)

Well, I am afraid I cannot afford not to have a phone on me during certain times of the day. Even if I am on the pasture.

To her credit, the horse didn't intend to break the phone. She is usually very sorry when she breaks something. Specially of the broken thing used to be fun or useful, such as that perimeter concrete wall she topped over by scratching her butt against it.

--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (21:2/138)

Arelor wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

I think Linux/BSD on a portable device such as a table of phone would
be awesome, but then I suspect people would not use it as an Android replacement at all. I rather picture technicians doing pen-testing from their tablets or patching software on the fly. Portable gadgets like
these are uncomfortable to work on but if they could run the proper software they could be good portable toolboxes for IT people.

I've seen some UIs that look like a regular phone, so they could be used as
a replacement for Android/iPhone - with more customization if you dig a little.

I'd love to run full Linux on a phone - I'm imagining adding a bluetooth keyboard with a pointing device and using it as a laptop replacement. I've
had to lug a laptop around since 1995, it'd be nice to travel light.


... Towards the insignificant
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

I'd played with an old Nokia 3110 for a month at a time, unfortunately, the 2G and 3G networks are going away (or are already gone around here) making older phones bricks.

That's the problem in my area too. I had a Motorola RAZR2 that I loved but
can no longer use it. Round here the only 4G/LTE "feature phones" are
Alcatel Go-Flips and they're not that good. Tons of choice in developing countries but the manufacturers don't like to sell those devices in NA.

I have a couple of Blackberries (BB10 era, not the older ones) that I use as feature phones from time to time as they are 4G and email still works
(browsing the web not so much). But they're not LTE and some networks are dropping 4G for pure LTE which will eventually "brick" these devices too.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Free Speech You Smeg Head (21:1/225)

OGG(21:4/106.21) wrote to All <=-

Erik Finman, the youngest Bitcoin millionaire, has launched a
UNCENSORABLE mobile device he calls "the best phone in the
world" and that he says will take the fight to Big Tech.

The phone has its own App Store, an OS that has no app,
keyboard or location tracking and a privacy guard that warns
users when they're being tracked by any app or website, and
allows them to block it.

https://freedomphone.com/

I think people want to know whats the processor of the phone, how much memory is in the phone
before they want to buy this. I loathe Google, and Apple is slightly better, but still evil.

Also independent operating systems do need a neutral pay system like Samsung/Apple/Google Pay.

It sounds good, but there are a few things missing.

... 2 + 2 = 5 for extremely large values of 2.
--- MultiMail/Win v0.52


--- WWIV 5.7.2.3536
* Origin: inland utopia * socal usa * iutopia.mooo.com:2023 (21:4/108)

POINDEXTER FORTRAN(21:4/1 wrote to Ogg <=-

Bypassing the Google surveillance ecosystem is a huge leap in privacy.

I switch my search engine to DuckDuck Go and Bing on my devices.
I also need to migrate my emails out of gmail also.

Between the choice of apps (really? You're going to put Parler on a
phone that respects your privacy?) and the wavy American flag on the

Parler is sadly a joke and lost their reputation with most in that community.

Give me a phone running AOSP or something close to it, don't load
google services, include Tor and a VPN service, Signal as a SMS client,
an alternative app store and a privacy-aware browser, any day.

I think people across the spectrum can agree on this. With Google we are the commodity.



... Computer Hacker wanted. Must have own axe.
--- MultiMail/Win v0.52


--- WWIV 5.7.2.3536
* Origin: inland utopia * socal usa * iutopia.mooo.com:2023 (21:4/108)

Re: Re: freedom phone
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Arelor on Sat Jul 17 2021 06:41 am

I'd love to run full Linux on a phone - I'm imagining adding a bluetooth keyboard with a pointing device and using it as a laptop replacement. I've had to lug a laptop around since 1995, it'd be nice to travel light.

Last month's Linux Magazine has an article about doing just that. You may use a program called UserLand (I think) and run a quite complete Linux environment, using a mouse, a keyboard and an external screen.

The article includes some benchmarks. A system running under this configuration is not going to displace an actual computer but it looks serviceable.

No rooting required.

--
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Utopian Galt wrote to Ogg <=-

I think people want to know whats the processor of the phone, how much memory is in the phone
before they want to buy this. I loathe Google, and Apple is slightly better, but still evil.

Apple has dropped to 3rd in phone sales now. Samsung holds the lead still.
I found that a bit interesting.

... Old hypochondriacs never die, they just lose their grippe.
--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
* Origin: Carnage - risen from the dead now on SBBS (21:4/107)

Otto Reverse wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

I have a couple of Blackberries (BB10 era, not the older ones) that I
use as feature phones from time to time as they are 4G and email still works (browsing the web not so much). But they're not LTE and some networks are dropping 4G for pure LTE which will eventually "brick"
these devices too.

It's getting bad. My cheap MVNO is starting to blacklist perfectly fine 4G
LTE phones, then professing an inability to get an unlocked 4G LTE phone on their network in what appears to be an attempt to sell more of their branded phones.

Unfortunately, they're cheap and I rely on their wifi calling. I could go
with AT&T and get a femtocell for my house, and pay a ton more for the same thing.

Fortunately, they have cheap Motorola Android phones, which I like. Big batteries and pretty close to Vanilla android without a lot of pre-loaded crap.


... Abandon desire
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

Utopian Galt wrote to Poindexter Fortran <=-

I think people across the spectrum can agree on this. With Google we
are the commodity.

If I didn't rely on wi-fi calling from my carrier, I'd see if I could unlock the boot loader of my phone, put on Lineage, and limit the number of google services running on the phone.

Unfortunately, I'd bet good money that my carrier wouldn't allow wi-fi
calling on a third-party OS, to help drive sales of their phones.

I just noticed that the PinePhone is shipping now and is $199. Looks interesting.


... The city devours the land, the people devour the city...
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

Arelor wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

Last month's Linux Magazine has an article about doing just that. You
may use a program called UserLand (I think) and run a quite complete
Linux environment, using a mouse, a keyboard and an external screen.

Interesting. Motorola made a net-top (I think that's what they called it) which was a shell of a laptop that the phone docked into, gave you Android
on a 13" laptop screen with keyboard and trackpad.

Samsung has tried something before, which I think has fizzled out.

I played with Kali Linux on an old rooted Samsung, that gave me a full linux environment with VNC running. Pair that with a "thin client" laptop that
just ran VNC and you'd have an interesting setup.

All I need now is for people to feel comfortable working in coffee shops again.


... The city devours the land, the people devour the city...
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

Hello poindexter FORTRAN!

** On Sunday 18.07.21 - 09:56, poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Utopian Galt:

I just noticed that the PinePhone is shipping now and is
$199. Looks interesting.

The specs don't indicate the cell bands it supports.
Therefore, the Pinephone is really just a scaled-down-to-
phonesize tablet that uses wifi for IP phone services?


--- OpenXP 5.0.50
* Origin: (} Pointy McPointFace (21:4/106.21)

I just noticed that the PinePhone is shipping now and is
$199. Looks interesting.

The specs don't indicate the cell bands it supports.
Therefore, the Pinephone is really just a scaled-down-to-
phonesize tablet that uses wifi for IP phone services?

NEVERMIND! I see "Quectel EG-25G with worldwide bands"
Apparently that supports "Worldwide LTE, UMTS/HSPA+ and GSM/
GPRS/EDGE coverage"

That's sounds like a sweet phone, indeed.


--- OpenXP 5.0.50
* Origin: (} Pointy McPointFace (21:4/106.21)

BY: poindexter FORTRAN(21:4/122)


|11pF|09> |10their network in what appears to be an attempt to sell more of their|07
|11pF|09> |10branded phones.|07
Are you speaking about Republic Wireless? I am thinking about just getting 2 unlocked phones, an iphone 12s/13 and a oneplus n200 and have them as my devices without having to deal with the big 3.


--- WWIV 5.7.2.3536
* Origin: inland utopia * socal usa * iutopia.mooo.com:2023 (21:4/108)

Re: Re: freedom phone
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Otto Reverse on Sun Jul 18 2021 09:51 am

Otto Reverse wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

I have a couple of Blackberries (BB10 era, not the older ones) that I use as feature phones from time to time as they are 4G and email still works (browsing the web not so much). But they're not LTE and some networks are dropping 4G for pure LTE which will eventually "brick" these devices too.

It's getting bad. My cheap MVNO is starting to blacklist perfectly fine 4G LTE phones, then professing an inability to get an unlocked 4G LTE phone on their network in what appears to be an attempt to sell more of their branded phones.

Unfortunately, they're cheap and I rely on their wifi calling. I could go with AT&T and get a femtocell for my house, and pay a ton more for the same thing.

Fortunately, they have cheap Motorola Android phones, which I like. Big batteries and pretty close to Vanilla android without a lot of pre-loaded crap.

... Abandon desire

I have learnt there is not such a thing as a cheap telco plan.

There are plans in which you pay a pitance, but then you get a service so crappy it is not worth calling a service. The cheapos have a tendency to come with lame customer support and its providers love the sound of a knife going into your back everytime they feel like changing the conditions of the
service.

Suffices to say that I'd rather have no data plan with my phone and leech public wifi spots than paying for a cheapo no-plan. If you depend on the service you need a provider you can trust; if not you just go gypsy style and leech free wifi like crazy.


--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (21:2/138)

Ogg wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

I just noticed that the PinePhone is shipping now and is
$199. Looks interesting.

The specs don't indicate the cell bands it supports.
Therefore, the Pinephone is really just a scaled-down-to-
phonesize tablet that uses wifi for IP phone services?

Their wiki shows support for most carriers on a couple of linux images.


... Which parts can be grouped?
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

Utopian Galt wrote to Poindexter Fortran <=-

Are you speaking about Republic Wireless? I am thinking about just
getting 2 unlocked phones, an iphone 12s/13 and a oneplus n200 and have them as my devices without having to deal with the big 3.

No, I'm on Cricket Wireless. $120 for 4 phones with their high speed
service, bandwidth capped at 25gb, 5gb of hotspot bandwidth.

They used to heavily advertise their BYOD services, but after the 3G
shutdown, they started publishing a white list. Now, they're advising people with 4G LTE non-VoLTE phones that they aren't going to work, despite working just fine for some time. People have had their accounts blocked for taking a SIM card out of a working phone and trying it out in a non-whitelisted
phone.

It feels like their best solution is to buy one of their branded phones.



... Which parts can be grouped?
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

Arelor wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

Suffices to say that I'd rather have no data plan with my phone and
leech public wifi spots than paying for a cheapo no-plan. If you depend
on the service you need a provider you can trust; if not you just go
gypsy style and leech free wifi like crazy.

Cricket used to have an app for Android that would do just that - automatically connect to any free wifi it found, and it had some sort of database to list priority. They called it a "data saver app".

It quietly disappeared, but I have the .apk somewhere. Marketing probably
told the product people that data = money to them.


... Which parts can be grouped?
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

Adept wrote to Mindsurfer <=-

Incidentally, this is why I kind of hope that 68k.news remains pretty small. It's a delight to use, is great for use in logging into hotel networks (or other networks that hijack web pages for login), doesn't
have clickbait or unexpected videos, and boy howdy would it be ended by _someone_ if it got remotely big.

So, umm, don't tell your friends?

LOL - hadn't heard of this, but will check it out...




... This line is intentionally NOT blank.
--- MultiMail/Mac v0.52
* Origin: Omicron Theta * Southaven MS * winserver.org (21:2/136)

Right! The only thing I use my phone for these days, is chatting on
Matrix, reading some news and running a BBS from lol. I don't remember
the last time I actually made a phone call with it haha.

Let me install AmigaOS on it.. now *that's* a freedom phone I'd get
behind.

;)


--- Talisman v0.24-dev (Linux/x86_64)
* Origin: Lost Underground BBS (21:1/230)

On 18 Jul 2021, Arelor said the following...

137
Re: Re: freedom phone
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Arelor on Sat Jul 17 2021 06:41 am

I'd love to run full Linux on a phone - I'm imagining adding a bluetoot keyboard with a pointing device and using it as a laptop replacement. I had to lug a laptop around since 1995, it'd be nice to travel light.

Last month's Linux Magazine has an article about doing just that. You
may use a program called UserLand (I think) and run a quite complete
Linux environment, using a mouse, a keyboard and an external screen.

Glytch with Hak5 does similar. He's got a Galaxy Fold Z2 that he runs in Dex mode with an external keyboard. If he needs to do anything with a full terminal he SSHes to a Pi that he carries with him. I think he covers it in one of these two videos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oOZkyqIBwY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yl_vXlf-MOY

GreenLFC � e> greenleaderfanclub@protonmail.com
Infosec / Ham / Retro � masto> greenleaderfanclub@distrotoot
Avoids Politics on BBS � gem> gemini.greenleader.xyz

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/06/21 (Raspberry Pi/32)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbs>>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

I'd love to run full Linux on a phone - I'm imagining adding a blu keyboard with a pointing device and using it as a laptop replaceme had to lug a laptop around since 1995, it'd be nice to travel ligh

Glytch with Hak5 does similar. He's got a Galaxy Fold Z2 that he runs
in Dex mode with an external keyboard. If he needs to do anything with
a full terminal he SSHes to a Pi that he carries with him. I think he covers it in one of these two videos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oOZkyqIBwY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yl_vXlf-MOY

I loved Glytch's videos about blocking the cellular DATA/wifi connections throttling and monthly limits - at the time I had a verizon MyFi and was easily able to get unlimited monthly data and no throttling because of the information he gave - amazing that the Linux tools we use daily allows us [or, an intelligent and capable linux operator anyway] block the big guys attempts at throttling. w00t w00t!



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/06/21 (Raspberry Pi/32)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbs>>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

is really a junky phone made by a chineese oem that you can get in bulk from aliexpress for like 120. If it was a qualcom processor and was more like a regular oem I would of spent the money.


--- WWIV 5.7.2.3536
* Origin: inland utopia * socal usa * iutopia.mooo.com:2023 (21:4/108)

is really a junky phone made by a chineese oem that you can get in bulk from aliexpress for like 120. If it was a qualcom processor and was
more like a regular oem I would of spent the money.

Thats what I'm thinking, too. :P I just want a Linux solution that works well for both Linuxy stuff AND:

phone
text
data

We can't be THAT far off - for now I remain with my iPhone, tracky as it is... it does all the fancy stuff - and a PinePhone to play with Linuxy stuff on mobile... but I'll fully switch over once theres a Linux option that can do all the things my iPhone does.

Doesn't even have to do it AS WELL - so long as I'M the SYSOP.



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/06/21 (Raspberry Pi/32)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbs>>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

Hello paulie420!

** On Monday 19.07.21 - 17:31, paulie420 wrote to Greenlfc:

I loved Glytch's videos about blocking the cellular DATA/
wifi connections throttling and monthly limits - at the
time I had a verizon MyFi and was easily able to get
unlimited monthly data and no throttling because of the
information he gave - amazing that the Linux tools we use
daily allows us [or, an intelligent and capable linux
operator anyway] block the big guys attempts at throttling.
w00t w00t!

Is it this one?

Unlimited LTE Hotspot on PC via Phone or USB modem! -GlytchTips https://youtu.be/WHqlYILMhgg

One simple netsh line... and the guy can't just put it in the
desc or the text part for easy copy-paste? Sheeesh.

I have to watch 2:30m of a 5m video before he even starts
typing.

This video is shorter and gets straight to the meat:

Bypasss Hotspot limit with default hop limit - Explanation https://youtu.be/HKZ_GfmRvmc

But I still have to wonder why simply changing the
defaultcurhoplimit is all it takes to de-throttle a connection.


--- OpenXP 5.0.50
* Origin: (} Pointy McPointFace (21:4/106.21)

On 19 Jul 2021, Jimmy Anderson said the following...

Adept wrote to Mindsurfer <=-

Incidentally, this is why I kind of hope that 68k.news remains pretty small. It's a delight to use, is great for use in logging into hotel networks (or other networks that hijack web pages for login), doesn't have clickbait or unexpected videos, and boy howdy would it be ended _someone_ if it got remotely big.

So, umm, don't tell your friends?

LOL - hadn't heard of this, but will check it out...

I'm pretty sure Action Retro said on one of his videos that he open sourced the code, so worst case you ought to be able to roll your own and just not advertise it.

GreenLFC � e> greenleaderfanclub@protonmail.com
Infosec / Ham / Retro � masto> greenleaderfanclub@distrotoot
Avoids Politics on BBS � gem> gemini.greenleader.xyz

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/06/21 (Raspberry Pi/32)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbs>>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

Re: Re: freedom phone
By: Greenlfc to Arelor on Mon Jul 19 2021 07:28 am

Last month's Linux Magazine has an article about doing just that. You may use a program called UserLand (I think) and run a quite complete Linux environment, using a mouse, a keyboard and an external screen.

Glytch with Hak5 does similar. He's got a Galaxy Fold Z2 that he runs in De mode with an external keyboard. If he needs to do anything with a full terminal he SSHes to a Pi that he carries with him. I think he covers it in one of these two videos:

I don't visit Youtube links, so I will take your word for it :-)

I know of people who uses their smartphones as seudo-dumb terminals to connect to proper Linux / BSD boxes in order to have a "Unix Experience" with their Android, but I somehow feel that is cheating.

Still, if you are using a custom ROM for the phone which is trustworthy up to some point, it sounds to me like a good way of doing phone computing.

--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (21:2/138)

I loved Glytch's videos about blocking the cellular DATA/
wifi connections throttling and monthly limits

Is it this one?
Unlimited LTE Hotspot on PC via Phone or USB modem! -GlytchTips https://youtu.be/WHqlYILMhgg

Yes, I believe so...

One simple netsh line... and the guy can't just put it in the
desc or the text part for easy copy-paste? Sheeesh.

This video is shorter and gets straight to the meat:
Bypasss Hotspot limit with default hop limit - Explanation https://youtu.be/HKZ_GfmRvmc

Thanks; I haven't seen this person before and will see what other things they talk about in their videos.

But I still have to wonder why simply changing the
defaultcurhoplimit is all it takes to de-throttle a connection.

So I am NOT super intelligent on network stuff, but I got tons of articles by just searching 'defaultcurhoplimit'... explained it well, and many ways to disable all the carriers throttling.



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/06/21 (Raspberry Pi/32)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbs>>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

On 17 Jul 2021, Utopian Galt said the following...

I think people want to know whats the processor of the phone, how much memory is in the phone
before they want to buy this. I loathe Google, and Apple is slightly better, but still evil.

Also independent operating systems do need a neutral pay system like Samsung/Apple/Google Pay.

I would be interested in seeing the specs myself. Looks pretty sketchy actually. From the demos I've seen it looks like a rebranded Umidigi A9, which is a Chinese phone. Oh, and you can get it for about $120 rather than the $500 Freedom Phone is charging for it.

There are a lot of other things that make this seem pretty sketchy and a rip-off but I'm sure that an internet search would show those without me going into it.

Personally I am waiting for the Pixel 6 pro to come out. Easy to root and load whatever I want on it and make my own "freedom phone"

-=>Richard Miles<=-
-=>Captain Obvious<=-
-=>bbs.shadowscope.com<=-

... User Error: Replace user and hit any key to continue...

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/07/16 (Windows/32)
* Origin: * Shadowscope BBS * (21:1/157)

On 18 Jul 2021, Ogg said the following...

The specs don't indicate the cell bands it supports.
Therefore, the Pinephone is really just a scaled-down-to-
phonesize tablet that uses wifi for IP phone services?

Worldwide, Global LTE bands
LTE-FDD: B1/ B2/ B3/ B4/ B5/ B7/ B8/ B12/ B13/ B18/ B19/ B20/ B25/ B26/ B28 LTE-TDD: B38/ B39/ B40/ B41
WCDMA: B1/ B2/ B4/ B5/ B6/ B8/ B19
GSM: 850/900/1800/1900MHz

-=>Richard Miles<=-
-=>Captain Obvious<=-
-=>bbs.shadowscope.com<=-

... Reward for a job well done: More work

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/07/16 (Windows/32)
* Origin: * Shadowscope BBS * (21:1/157)

On 18 Jul 2021, Ogg said the following...

NEVERMIND! I see "Quectel EG-25G with worldwide bands"
Apparently that supports "Worldwide LTE, UMTS/HSPA+ and GSM/

Heh. Right after I posted my last message. That's what I get for being a few days behind.

-=>Richard Miles<=-
-=>Captain Obvious<=-
-=>bbs.shadowscope.com<=-

... A Meteor is an example of a rock star.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/07/16 (Windows/32)
* Origin: * Shadowscope BBS * (21:1/157)

Hello Captain Obvious!

** On Thursday 22.07.21 - 19:22, Captain Obvious wrote to Utopian Galt:

I would be interested in seeing the specs myself. Looks
pretty sketchy actually. From the demos I've seen it looks
like a rebranded Umidigi A9, which is a Chinese phone. Oh,
and you can get it for about $120 rather than the $500
Freedom Phone is charging for it.

The $500 price tag is to cover the cost of the phone and the
time to replace the original apps and to ship the re-engineered
product. What would YOU charge if you did the same thing?
..probably $400-$500. ;-) Right?

Personally I am waiting for the Pixel 6 pro to come out.
Easy to root and load whatever I want on it and make my
own "freedom phone".

That's the thing.. MOST people would probably not have the
confidence to do all that properly. So.. they are quite
prepared to pay someone to build a "freedom phone" for them.




--- OpenXP 5.0.50
* Origin: (} Pointy McPointFace (21:4/106.21)

Re: freedom phone
By: Captain Obvious to Utopian Galt on Thu Jul 22 2021 07:22 pm

Personally I am waiting for the Pixel 6 pro to come out. Easy to root and lo whatever I want on it and make my own "freedom phone"

Actually, turning a smartphone into an actually trusty device is very hard (as explained in some links and posts I left earlier). It is easy enough to flash certain devices with a ROM you like, but ensuring it is not funky is harder than people thinks.

--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (21:2/138)

Re: freedom phone
By: Ogg to Captain Obvious on Thu Jul 22 2021 09:50 pm

Hello Captain Obvious!

** On Thursday 22.07.21 - 19:22, Captain Obvious wrote to Utopian Galt:

I would be interested in seeing the specs myself. Looks
pretty sketchy actually. From the demos I've seen it looks
like a rebranded Umidigi A9, which is a Chinese phone. Oh,
and you can get it for about $120 rather than the $500
Freedom Phone is charging for it.

The $500 price tag is to cover the cost of the phone and the
time to replace the original apps and to ship the re-engineered
product. What would YOU charge if you did the same thing?
..probably $400-$500. ;-) Right?

Personally I am waiting for the Pixel 6 pro to come out.
Easy to root and load whatever I want on it and make my
own "freedom phone".

That's the thing.. MOST people would probably not have the
confidence to do all that properly. So.. they are quite
prepared to pay someone to build a "freedom phone" for them.

Maybe you'd like to check the /e/ phone.

They offer their ROMS and software stack for you to install yourself and also they give you the option of buying a phone from them preloaded with all their stuff.

As far as I know they have done a lot of work to deGooglefy their environment, so you may expect the phone not to leak much data to Google. Still I don't know how good it will be for darknet / VPN / hard opsec work.

--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (21:2/138)

On 23 Jul 2021, Arelor said the following...

Actually, turning a smartphone into an actually trusty device is very
hard (as explained in some links and posts I left earlier). It is easy enough to flash certain devices with a ROM you like, but ensuring it is not funky is harder than people thinks.

And, even if you have a perfectly secure OS ROM, but you still have the baseband firmware to worry about... A lot depends on your threat model, of course.

GreenLFC � e> greenleaderfanclub@protonmail.com
Infosec / Ham / Retro � masto> greenleaderfanclub@distrotoot
Avoids Politics on BBS � gem> gemini.greenleader.xyz

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/06/21 (Raspberry Pi/32)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbs>>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

On 22 Jul 2021, Ogg said the following...

The $500 price tag is to cover the cost of the phone and the
time to replace the original apps and to ship the re-engineered
product. What would YOU charge if you did the same thing?
..probably $400-$500. ;-) Right?

That's just it. After doing a bit more research it doesn't look like they are replacing anything. They are using the Google Play Store, through Aurora (a play store client, https://gitlab.com/AuroraOSS/AuroraStore). How that
translates to "uncensorable app store" is beyond me.

My understanding is that you can add repositories besides Google to it so
they could be doing that. Personally I use F-Droid in addition to the play store.

I definitely would charge more on the top if I did all the work. Don't know know about 1000% markup though. That's pretty high.

I can't say with 100% certainty since I don't have my hands on one yet but judging from what I've seen there's nothing that's been re-engineered. They've slapped some apps on top of LOS (Lineage OS, a ROM for Android) along with Aurora once and then burned that to some phones. Not to mention that if you
DO access Aurora using your normal Google Account can get you banned. It's pretty simple to just use a new account, I hope they put that in their instructions as a lot of people just don't read or understand that stuff.

-=>Richard Miles<=-
-=>Captain Obvious<=-
-=>bbs.shadowscope.com<=-

... Kilometers are shorter than miles. Save gas, take your trip in kilometers

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/07/16 (Windows/32)
* Origin: * Shadowscope BBS * (21:1/157)

On 22 Jul 2021, Ogg said the following...

The $500 price tag is to cover the cost of the phone and the
time to replace the original apps and to ship the re-engineered product. What would YOU charge if you did the same thing? ..probably $400-$500. ;-) Right?

That's just it. After doing a bit more research it doesn't look like
they are replacing anything. They are using the Google Play Store,
through Aurora (a play store client, https://gitlab.com/AuroraOSS/AuroraStore). How that translates to "uncensorable app store" is beyond me.

My understanding is that you can add repositories besides Google to it
so they could be doing that. Personally I use F-Droid in addition to
the play store.

I definitely would charge more on the top if I did all the work. Don't know know about 1000% markup though. That's pretty high.

I can't say with 100% certainty since I don't have my hands on one yet
but judging from what I've seen there's nothing that's been re-engineered. They've slapped some apps on top of LOS (Lineage OS, a
ROM for Android) along with Aurora once and then burned that to some phones. Not to mention that if you DO access Aurora using your normal Google Account can get you banned. It's pretty simple to just use a new account, I hope they put that in their instructions as a lot of people just don't read or understand that stuff.

-=>Richard Miles<=-
-=>Captain Obvious<=-
-=>bbs.shadowscope.com<=-

... Kilometers are shorter than miles. Save gas, take your trip in kilometers

Come to find out its a Korean $100 phone rebranded as FreedomUSA.

Scam.Hustle.Suck

... To the best of our knowledge, we are not schizophrenic.



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/06/21 (Raspberry Pi/32)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbs>>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

Hello paulie420!

** On Saturday 24.07.21 - 22:51, paulie420 wrote to Captain Obvious:

On 22 Jul 2021, Ogg said the following...

The $500 price tag is to cover the cost of the phone and the
time to replace the original apps and to ship..

Come to find out its a Korean $100 phone rebranded as FreedomUSA.

Scam.Hustle.Suck

But.. $100 (cost of phone) + $400 for the cost of reinstalling
fresh OS and apps, and testing and shipping. Wouldn't you
charge the same?

;)


--- OpenXP 5.0.50
* Origin: (} Pointy McPointFace (21:4/106.21)

The $500 price tag is to cover the cost of the phone and the
time to replace the original apps and to ship..

Come to find out its a Korean $100 phone rebranded as FreedomUSA. Scam.Hustle.Suck

But.. $100 (cost of phone) + $400 for the cost of reinstalling
fresh OS and apps, and testing and shipping. Wouldn't you
charge the same?

I guess we'll wait and see - but ALL of the data I've seen and heard about so far DOESN'T suggest that there will be software that supports charging 4x the cost of the hardware.

We'll see what they deliver, but;

Hardware without datasheets almost ALWAYS equals cruddy hardware...
I don't fathom that this individual/company will deliver software that is security hardened; probably will end up being LESS secure because its closed and... nothing new.
Slap a few American flags on a site, say FB sucks and pre-load Parlour.... I just don't see what the OFFERing is?



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/06/21 (Raspberry Pi/32)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbs>>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

That's the thing.. MOST people would probably not have the
confidence to do all that properly. So.. they are quite
prepared to pay someone to build a "freedom phone" for them.

Something y'all might want to talk a look at, is Kali Linux distro for smartphones: https://www.kali.org/get-kali/#kali-mobile

they showed this too on "Mr.Robot"

Thanks
- Gamecube Buddy

telnet --<{bbs.hive32.com:23333}>--

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Hive32 (21:4/129)

Re: re: freedom phone
By: gcubebuddy to Arelor on Mon Jul 26 2021 06:49 pm

That's the thing.. MOST people would probably not have the confidence to do all that properly. So.. they are quite
prepared to pay someone to build a "freedom phone" for them.

Something y'all might want to talk a look at, is Kali Linux distro for smartphones: https://www.kali.org/get-kali/#kali-mobile

they showed this too on "Mr.Robot"

Thanks
- Gamecube Buddy

telnet --<{bbs.hive32.com:23333}>--

That sounds interesting, but aren't they building upon regular Android variants? I see they list ROMs vased on LineageOS, for example.


--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (21:2/138)

But.. $100 (cost of phone) + $400 for the cost of reinstalling fresh OS and apps, and testing and shipping. Wouldn't you
charge the same?

about so far DOESN'T suggest that there will be software that supports charging 4x the cost of the hardware.

To be fair, Ogg added the :) because he was poking fun at a previous comment about what would be a reasonable markup for such a project, if it were on the level rather than preying on a subset of conservatives.

But, yeah, all the signs are that it's as scammy of a product as you can get while having a chance at being legal.

I'd love it if there were a true secure/private phone that made making your phone secure/protect your privacy with minimal effort.

But this... It does seem like something where, if someone wants that set of apps, they should buy a quality phone (or a cheaper budget phone) and pay the nearest teenager a reasonable fee to install that list of applications, and
get them setup with whatever accounts they need.

Or just do it themselves, but I'm imagining the average customer for this is not someone who ever called BBSs with a real modem, even though they probably clearly remember the 1980s.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Storm BBS (21:2/108)

That sounds interesting, but aren't they building upon regular Android variants? I see they list ROMs vased on LineageOS, for example.

that could be a possibility. you can always install it on "temple OS" lol.

what i would do is read what it requires, and then if it requires a vanilla version of android and go through the process of locking it down. my guess is there is probably some version out there espically from Kali that is hardened out of the box. i would be careful though on who you download the image from.

i had a co-worker once that told me of a friend that downloaded a custom ISO
of Kody video player from an unknown source and was running it on his home system. the FBI ended up at his house as it was unknown to him, streaming
child porn from a backend port on his Kody video system, and the FBI tracked
it to his house. apparently the raked him over the coals for 6 months due to that.
be careful :-)

Thanks
- Gamecube Buddy

telnet --<{bbs.hive32.com:23333}>--

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Hive32 (21:4/129)

On 26 Jul 2021, gcubebuddy said the following...

Something y'all might want to talk a look at, is Kali Linux distro for smartphones: https://www.kali.org/get-kali/#kali-mobile

I've got an old Oneplus 7 here, I may load it up and take a look. Thanks.

-=>Richard Miles<=-
-=>Captain Obvious<=-
-=>bbs.shadowscope.com<=-

... I got everything but the part after "Now listen closely."

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/07/23 (Windows/32)
* Origin: * Shadowscope BBS * (21:1/157)

Re: Re: freedom phone
By: Adept to paulie420 on Mon Jul 26 2021 07:28 pm

But this... It does seem like something where, if someone wants that set of apps, they should buy a quality phone (or a cheaper budget phone) and pay th nearest teenager a reasonable fee to install that list of applications, and get them setup with whatever accounts they need.

Haha, paying somebody for IT service.

Maybe it is a Spanish thing, but nobody does it out of Enterprise environments anymore, it seems. The only exception are very old peoplñe.

I mean, everytime I visit the local IT store/workshop for parts, what they have there is a queue of grandpas paying for malware removal or fixing broken software.

Everybody else just forces their kids to do whatever IT work needs to be done. It is very hard to sell any IT service to domestic end consumers because they can always get their kid to patch something up even if their solution is far from professional quality. There is this idea that domestic IT tasks are worthless and that they are not worth paying for because the kid can do them.

Which is why I find the idea of paying a teenager to load a custom ROM so funny. Here they'd just tell the teenager to do it because "it costs you no effort." And they would get angry if the teenager refused.

--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (21:2/138)

Which is why I find the idea of paying a teenager to load a custom ROM so funny. Here they'd just tell the teenager to do it because "it costs you no effort." And they would get angry if the teenager refused.

Eh, I didn't mean "load a custom ROM", as that would take a greater level of technical competence.

I meant, "install a few apps and make a few accounts", which is fully in the range of what most every teenager can do.

And, yeah, a lot of people could probably find their own free technical support.

And those who say, "it costs you no effort" should just be able to figure it out on their own, right? Since it's easy enough that anyone can do it.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Storm BBS (21:2/108)

Re: Re: freedom phone
By: Adept to Arelor on Tue Jul 27 2021 04:38 pm

And those who say, "it costs you no effort" should just be able to figure it out on
their own, right? Since it's easy enough that anyone can do it.

Exactly.

Bonus points when they tell you they want to run Windows because everything else is so
difficult, and they are not tech-literate enough to install a random program in their
Windows 10 anyway.

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gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (21:2/138)

To be fair, Ogg added the :) because he was poking fun at a previous comment about what would be a reasonable markup for such a project, if
it were on the level rather than preying on a subset of conservatives.

But, yeah, all the signs are that it's as scammy of a product as you can get while having a chance at being legal.

I'd love it if there were a true secure/private phone that made making your phone secure/protect your privacy with minimal effort.

But this... It does seem like something where, if someone wants that set of apps, they should buy a quality phone (or a cheaper budget phone) and pay the nearest teenager a reasonable fee to install that list of applications, and get them setup with whatever accounts they need.

Or just do it themselves, but I'm imagining the average customer for
this is not someone who ever called BBSs with a real modem, even though they probably clearly remember the 1980s.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Linux/64)

I've given up on trying to have a cell phone that IS private and respects me as a paying customer. I just try to sandbox it from any other computing that I do. My cell phone DOES track me and I'm sure that a state actor could find out exactly where I was 6 years ago at 3:00pm on a random Thursday... but they don't cross over and have access to my home computing. LOL - Or at least I haven't seen where I'm failing there - YET.

:P

Long story short, we're all 'screwed' and this 'Freedom Phone' isn't the answer to anything - other than a new buzzword tech hardware that right leaning folks will WASTE 400 on. :P

IMO.



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/06/21 (Raspberry Pi/32)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbs>>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

Re: re:freedom phone
By: gcubebuddy to Arelor on Mon Jul 26 2021 08:15 pm

That sounds interesting, but aren't they building upon regular Android variants? I see they list ROMs vased on LineageOS, for example.

that could be a possibility. you can always install it on "temple OS" lol.

what i would do is read what it requires, and then if it requires a vanilla version of android and go through the process of locking it down. my guess i there is probably some version out there espically from Kali that is hardene out of the box. i would be careful though on who you download the image from

i had a co-worker once that told me of a friend that downloaded a custom ISO of Kody video player from an unknown source and was running it on his home system. the FBI ended up at his house as it was unknown to him, streaming child porn from a backend port on his Kody video system, and the FBI tracked it to his house. apparently the raked him over the coals for 6 months due to that.
be careful :-)

Thanks
- Gamecube Buddy

telnet --<{bbs.hive32.com:23333}>--

I looked at it, and what Kali ofers is an overlay of forensics and hacking tools that you either install over regular Android, or an Android variant.

It does not make your phone more safe against trackers. It gives you a lot of cool tools and that is it.

That said, the idea is way cool.

--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (21:2/138)

I looked at it, and what Kali ofers is an overlay of forensics and
hacking tools that you either install over regular Android, or an
Android variant.
It does not make your phone more safe against trackers. It gives you a
lot of cool tools and that is it.

oh ok, ya i havent had a chance to look to deeply into it. that is pretty
cool though about the tool sets.

Thanks
- Gamecube Buddy

telnet --<{bbs.hive32.com:23333}>--

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Hive32 (21:4/129)

BY: Arelor(21:2/138)


|11A|09> |10Bonus points when they tell you they want to run Windows because|07 |11A|09> |10everything else is so|07
|11A|09> |10difficult, and they are not tech-literate enough to install a random|07
|11A|09> |10program in their Windows 10 anyway.|07
And that is a tragedy in society itself.


--- WWIV 5.7.2.3536
* Origin: inland utopia * socal usa * iutopia.mooo.com:2023 (21:4/108)

Bonus points when they tell you they want to run Windows because everything else is so
difficult, and they are not tech-literate enough to install a

random

program in their Windows 10 anyway.

And that is a tragedy in society itself.

lol i was talking with a co-worker about how alot of the people i do password resets for, have no clue even what a "web browser" is. like they have never even heard of firefox / chrome / internet explorer ect.. they understand what google is.... and they think that is what internet is. i suspect its due to most people using apps on their phone to connect the "internet" which they believe is the facebook / instagram / youtube apps. and a google seach text
box on their phones homepage....
other wise - no clue on how to use a basic computer windows or not. most dont even know what version of windows they are using. i was telling a co-worker, there should be a minimal level of compitancy for using a basic comptuer for work. just to do their job. kind of disturbing how many people actually know nothing at all.

Thanks
- Gamecube Buddy

telnet --<{bbs.hive32.com:23333}>--

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Hive32 (21:4/129)

Hello All!

Bitcoin millionaire launches "Freedom Phone" to "fight the Big
tech overlords"

Erik Finman, the youngest Bitcoin millionaire, has launched a
UNCENSORABLE mobile device he calls "the best phone in the
world" and that he says will take the fight to Big Tech.

"Your data, your rules. I believe you have a voice that
deserves to be heard without being censored. Big Tech hold a
monopoly on public communication, dissemination of information,
and they are abusing that power."

The phone has its own App Store, an OS that has no app,
keyboard or location tracking and a privacy guard that warns
users when they're being tracked by any app or website, and
allows them to block it.

https://freedomphone.com/


--- OpenXP 5.0.50
* Origin: (} Pointy McPointFace (21:4/106.21)

https://freedomphone.com/

sounds promising.

i just thought about if big tech can do anything about it. what if big
apps are recognizing when you use the freedom phone and stop working?
like with rooted phones and payment apps?

but in general i like the idea of the freedom phone. you heard for how
much they are selling it? will the app store also work on other phones?
could you think of any cons or are there just pros?

Regards,
Stephan /Mindsurfer

--- MagickaBBS v0.15alpha (Linux/armv7l)
* Origin: FuNToPia telnet://funtopia.ddnss.eu:2023 (21:3/119)

Hello Mindsurfer!

** On Thursday 15.07.21 - 10:27, Mindsurfer wrote to Ogg:

https://freedomphone.com/

sounds promising.

[...]

but in general i like the idea of the freedom phone. you
heard for how much they are selling it? will the app store
also work on other phones? could you think of any cons or
are there just pros?

Maybe it's too early to know what it really is. In an article
in the SUN:

https://www.the-sun.com/lifestyle/3284914/what-is-the-freedom-
phone/

..it writes:

.."people took to Twitter to discuss the Freedom Phone's free
speech promise. [...] Another replied: "So you're telling me
a `Freedom Phone' is basically a generic Android Device, with
Parler, Telegram, Rumble, OAN, Newsroom, Duck Duck Go and a
VPN preloaded? Wow. A new sucker is born every day."

..so maybe it's not entirely what I thought it COULD be.


--- OpenXP 5.0.50
* Origin: (} Pointy McPointFace (21:4/106.21)

Hello Ogg;

Ogg wrote to Mindsurfer <=-

https://www.the-sun.com/lifestyle/3284914/what-is-the-freedom-
phone/

A publication that believes in data mining writes about it? Really?

..so maybe it's not entirely what I thought it COULD be.

On most common droids and iPhones, every keystroke is tracable. This was
told to me by a friend who's a forensics expert for our state police force. They can figure out who you text, what you say, etc. This freedom phone/OS
is supposed to strip that "feature" away. Beware of any publication that does NOT mention this.

... Old beekeepers never die, they just buzz off.
--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
* Origin: Carnage - risen from the dead now on SBBS (21:4/107)

Ogg wrote to Mindsurfer <=-

https://www.the-sun.com/lifestyle/3284914/what-is-the-freedom-
phone/

..it writes:

.."people took to Twitter to discuss the Freedom Phone's free
speech promise. [...] Another replied: "So you're telling me
a `Freedom Phone' is basically a generic Android Device, with
Parler, Telegram, Rumble, OAN, Newsroom, Duck Duck Go and a
VPN preloaded? Wow. A new sucker is born every day."

Bypassing the Google surveillance ecosystem is a huge leap in privacy.

Between the choice of apps (really? You're going to put Parler on a phone
that respects your privacy?) and the wavy American flag on the web site, they're aiming towards the "patriots" who feel that the left-wing tech companies and social networks are trying to "cancel" them.

Give me a phone running AOSP or something close to it, don't load google services, include Tor and a VPN service, Signal as a SMS client, an alternative app store and a privacy-aware browser, any day.




... The city devours the land, the people devour the city...
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

i just thought about if big tech can do anything about it. what if big apps are recognizing when you use the freedom phone and stop working?
like with rooted phones and payment apps?

I assume it's the sort of thing where an arms race happens if the pro-privacy things get a big enough portion of the market.

E.g., ad blockers were basically ignored until they became fairly common, at which point it became an arms race.

Incidentally, this is why I kind of hope that 68k.news remains pretty small. It's a delight to use, is great for use in logging into hotel networks
(or other networks that hijack web pages for login), doesn't have clickbait or unexpected videos, and boy howdy would it be ended by _someone_ if it got remotely big.

So, umm, don't tell your friends?

Maybe the same with the Freedom Phone, though I'm guessing that one probably needs a decently-large userbase to _survive_.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Storm BBS (21:2/108)

speech promise. [...] Another replied: "So you're telling me
a `Freedom Phone' is basically a generic Android Device, with

Oh. Well, that's disappointing.

I always hope for a phone that comes with as little as possible pre-installed.

Heck, I'm still not sure about phones having _phone_ functionality. Talk
about a feature I never use...

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Storm BBS (21:2/108)

Heck, I'm still not sure about phones having _phone_ functionality. Talk about a feature I never use...

Right! The only thing I use my phone for these days, is chatting on Matrix, reading some news and running a BBS from lol. I don't remember the last time I actually made a phone call with it haha.

---
|14Best regards,
|11Ch|03rist|11ia|15n |11a|03ka |11Me|03aTLoT|11io|15N

|07�� |08[|10eml|08] |15ml@erb.pw |07�� |08[|10web|08] |15www.erb.pw |07��Ŀ |07�� |08[|09fsx|08] |1521:1/158 |07�� |08[|11tqw|08] |151337:1/101 |07���� |07�� |08[|12rtn|08] |1580:774/81 |07�� |08[|14fdn|08] |152:250/5 |07����
|07�� |08[|10ark|08] |1510:104/2 |07��

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2020/12/04 (Linux/64)
* Origin: thE qUAntUm wOrmhOlE, rAmsgAtE, uK. bbs.erb.pw (21:1/158)

Re: RE: freedom phone
By: Mindsurfer to Ogg on Thu Jul 15 2021 10:27 am

https://freedomphone.com/

sounds promising.

i just thought about if big tech can do anything about it. what if big
apps are recognizing when you use the freedom phone and stop working?
like with rooted phones and payment apps?

but in general i like the idea of the freedom phone. you heard for how
much they are selling it? will the app store also work on other phones? could you think of any cons or are there just pros?

Regards,
Stephan /Mindsurfer

I personally think trying with cleansed Androids is a dead end for software freedom. There are cool cleansed Androids like Replicant and Lineageos already but they only get you so far. They aren't better Androids than Android and they can't expect to be.

The main problem with cleansed Androids is that people will try them out expecting to be able to do with them the same things they do on regular Android, and will become disappointed when they don't. The /E/ project seems mindful of this and therefore they are building a complete ecosystem for their phones (with their own filesharing, messaging etc) but I bet they will fail at runing many Android programs.

IMO we should be trying to build our own thing with its own ecosystem and strong points of its own. If it ever becomes popular enough then banks and playment gateways will develop their junk for it. An Android clone does not have strong points of its own - Android basically sucks, and an Android with less features is hard to market even if it comes with the BIG advantage of not selling your info to Googlñe E-Warlords.

--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (21:2/138)

Re: Re: freedom phone
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Ogg on Thu Jul 15 2021 06:53 am

Ogg wrote to Mindsurfer <=-

https://www.the-sun.com/lifestyle/3284914/what-is-the-freedom-
phone/

..it writes:

.."people took to Twitter to discuss the Freedom Phone's free
speech promise. [...] Another replied: "So you're telling me
a `Freedom Phone' is basically a generic Android Device, with
Parler, Telegram, Rumble, OAN, Newsroom, Duck Duck Go and a
VPN preloaded? Wow. A new sucker is born every day."

Bypassing the Google surveillance ecosystem is a huge leap in privacy.

Between the choice of apps (really? You're going to put Parler on a phone that respects your privacy?) and the wavy American flag on the web site, they're aiming towards the "patriots" who feel that the left-wing tech companies and social networks are trying to "cancel" them.

Give me a phone running AOSP or something close to it, don't load google services, include Tor and a VPN service, Signal as a SMS client, an alternative app store and a privacy-aware browser, any day.

... The city devours the land, the people devour the city...

Tor/VPN infrastructure in Android SUCKS hard if you are serious about it.

Some interesting work done in it: https://blog.torproject.org/mission-improbable-hardening-android-security-and-p rivacy

https://blog.torproject.org/mission-impossible-hardening-android-security-and-p rivacy

I recommend the second link to everybody who is interested.

The main problem is that Android likes setting the network up and sending network traffic before Tor or VPNs can be brought up during startup, so the whole setup is leaky unless you exercise extreme care. To the point you are supposed to use a freaking external device as a firewall with your phone to cut leaky traffic down.

Not to mention that many Android programs ignore or have mangled proxy configuration, so you cannot be sure a generic application configured to use a local Tor instance will actually use it. You need to be able to firewall and intercept the traffic of your own device to be sure because the Android implementation of nearly everything is a pile of stinking, uncontrolable Eldritch tentacles extracted straight from Necronomicon.

It is a dead end.

When I was into phone modding I found myself that I spent more time fighting
my own device than using it. Once you think you have set a firewall to block all the traffic that is not pushed through the anonimity network you like you find lots of programs that are not supposed to be generating network traffic are failing to download files because the download manager is trying to bypass your Tor instance and failing.

Mobile platforms can only be fixe one way. We have to take them to the backyard, put them on their knees and shoot them in the head so their terrorist attempts against sane design practices are put to an end. Then we have to start over with something that is at least _sane_.

Then, after 6 months of modding your phone and having it in a state in which it it leaks close to no information, you loose it in the pasture, your favourite horse finds it before you do, and then you have not a phone anymore.


And THIS is the reason why my daily phone is a Nokia 150 today.

--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (21:2/138)